597. - Jamie Oliver

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcast. or watch on YouTube. I think I'm recording How Long Gone. A beautiful, beautiful midday here in Los Angeles, California. What's going on over in Glendale, Jason? You got the same weather? I know sometimes it's different. Yeah, it's a microclimate. It started off so foggy. Foggy like the London fog from our guest today. But it has cleared up, hasn't it, Chris? It's sublime outside. Sublime featuring Rome outside. Thank God. Yeah, no, I needed it. After yesterday, I got to LA yesterday. There was some torrential downpours, and it never ceases to amaze me that when I come here, it rains. Yeah, whenever you come to L.A. and it rains, I feel it in my bones. You know, like if somebody breaks a bone when they're a kid, and you're like, oh, rain's coming, so I feel it. I can feel when you're about to fly from a colder... rainier more miserable place to this place the promised land utopia california etc and then it also rains during that time i feel it and i feel it's

I feel bad for you in the way that you feel bad for Larry David when something bad happens to him. I love feeling bad for you about it. So not at all. It's a hate to see you go, but love to watch you leave type of scenario. Okay, look, I'll take it. I'll take it. I mean, it's good to be back even just for a short time. We've got to go to San Francisco tomorrow for our big show. I'm excited for our meal at Kintz. Quintz. I like saying Kintz. Yeah, like how you would say the abbreviation for a quinceañera. Exactly. I'm in California. I'm in L.A., for Christ's sake. No, I'm excited to have another delicious Michelin-starred meal with you. It feels only appropriate. If it's not Michelin, what's the bloody point? What's the point? Also, speaking of that, I went to this Korean restaurant called... Soban. S-O-B-A-N. Okay. Famously known a few years ago is where the Parasite crew went after they won all the awards at the Oscars a couple years ago. What's your restaurant's claim to fame? Famous people came here after an award show and it was just kind of off to the races after that. It was like in the news and stuff. It was a big deal because it's a food that... They serve a type of cuisine that's like a little more... maybe like temple style food. There's a lot of fermentations. Okay. Um, it's a small menu. They don't serve alcohol. It ain't in and out. Well, it's, it's not like a crazy rock and sushi kind of vibe. It's not a place where you go to turn up. It's like you go to eat like a delicious, well-crafted fermented meal with, with tea and stuff like that. Okay. But they, they rented it out and like, you know, went until like six in the morning. Soju bombs, all that shit. Anyways. They've been recognized by the Michelin people over the years, but I wanted to give them a shout-out because the girl who runs it is a fan of the show. Oh, that's great. And she was blessing me with sick-ass banchan that she's been experimenting with. So did it taste good, or you just liked going there because she liked you? I've never been. It's my first time, and I've always kind of stayed away from it due to the fact that they don't serve alcohol, which...

I love Korean food with beer. It's just what I love. I thought Korean food was most often paired with alcohol. That was a big part of the appeal. Oftentimes, but they're not going to get drunk every single meal. They can eat regular food. Yeah, they're not Americans for Christ's sake. They're not going to get drunk every single time. I think a stereotypical viewpoint of a Korean restaurant, especially in America, is associated with alcohol consumption. That's safe to say. But bless me with the sunchoke banchan from the farmer's market, kissed with a little balsamic vinegar. I ate a fermented strawberry. from 2010 oh shit you had a vintage is the justice remix that's strawberry that's strawberries third on the bill at just like heaven fest that is the just like heaven fest tickets are available soon for pre-sale make sure you go check out the amazing lineup for uh the just like the lineup keeps getting better every year featuring them jeans and we've got others we've got them jeans we've got phoenix we've got death cap for cutie we've got the return of the gossip broken social scene but we We also have 10-year fermented strawberry, and that is kind of – what could be better than that? Girl, when I tasted that, it was so good. So did it send you? I was sent it. It was mothering me. Yeah, it's very syrupy, as you could imagine. You know when you taste one of those high dollar maraschino cherries, a Luxardo cherry? I've never eaten one of those. They look disgusting to me. But yeah, go ahead. Really? No. That's bar garnish. They're very expensive. Yeah, I know. I know. Bar garnish. Anyway, it's like that times a billion with a fresh strawberry. It still tastes fresh even though it's literally 14 years old. Just sitting in a tub for 14 years. It still tastes great. No, that's very cool. stuff like that but i would try it i think because it's it's too it's too weird not to try no it's a no harm no foul it's like the version you know when you like have like an eric wehrheim bros only wine thing where you go to a restaurant in san gabriel valley that you would not like and then we're opening up some seven and eight hundred dollar bottles of boujolet yeah sure it's like the version of that but with kombucha instead of wine if that makes sense so i guess that is kind of

for me then in a lot of ways because option option one isn't really available to me and and they don't you know i don't get the call from a meal because i'm not sipping like that but do you think a kombucha flight is more my so i don't really like that either but it feels like my only option kombucha flight no that's the one jay mascus takes from seattle to to amherst kombucha flight 398 Oh, man. Did you see what happened to kombucha 398? Oh, the door ripped off. It's too much fermentation. Yeah, poor Alaska. Yeah, now Alaska is just going to be the butt of everyone's joke for the next. Did you see, though, that the passengers only got $1,500 each? Damn. Bro, if the door comes off of my plane and I see my life flash before my eyes. I need at least six figures. Yeah, I agree with that. Well, I think the problem is some of those people, they didn't consult with their legal team and they took that offer. I agree with you. If I'm flying on an airplane and a chunk of the... hole comes flying off due to user error i'm gonna need something i'm gonna need at least a macbook pro not a macbook air yeah that's all yeah i'm gonna need airpod max if that's all if could we just do that i actually on my flight yesterday from um new york to la i had a lot of problems jason and i was was the wi-fi lit or unlit wi-fi didn't work my my screen didn't work So I had no entertainment of any kind. Luckily, you don't need it, right? No, I do need something. You never have to get prepared when you're always prepared, right, brother? It's a five-and-a-half-hour flight. I had a book, of course. It was no problem. But five-and-a-half hours of reading in one sitting is not the best. Even for your big brain. Yeah, even for my big brain. How much Kyle Chayka can one guy stomach? You know what I mean? So I just don't know.

But I was just kind of flabbergasted, and they just kept being like, I know, this plane's so old. And I'm like, bitch, that's not – we all know the plane is old. Don't tell me the plane is old. Do something about it. And they did bless me with 5,000 sky miles, but what is that going to do? I mean, that ain't nothing. Yeah, it's funny. To me, that really is sort of the downfall of man. Whenever we started not – really showing any remorse or apologies or solutions for anything in a in like a in a retail or business environment like i think all the time when i'm when i was like 16 and working at sears and somebody would need help you know like hey i want to buy this thingy and if it's out of stock i would be like i am so sorry we actually are out of stock right now here are the three solutions i could try to help you out and now it's just like we don't have it Oh, yeah. And then you're like, wait, what? So how can you is it going to be in stock soon? Check later. There's no there's no service. But I mean, the fine the fine stewardesses in Delta one were telling me no information with a smile on their face. OK, OK, that's not bad. I can't you know, I can't get so mad at it because also what the fuck are they going to do about it? It's not there. You know, it's not at any point. Did you say the words out loud to no one in particular? diamond medallion member i know i they they knew who they were talking to and they put some respect on my name but they only put 5 000 sky miles worth of respect which felt felt a little low uh but i mean i've only been diamond for like 22 days but the amount of times i've said it at the said the sentence as a diamond medallion member i just think it's funny the amount of times that's exited my mouth we have to speak it we have to speak it to it so our our um Our brothers and comrades at Condé Nast are striking today. And there's a click it line, so you're not supposed to go to any links. But breaking news is that celebrity Anne Hathaway walked out of a photo shoot after she found out about the work stoppage. Damn. And I just want to say to Anne Hathaway's team, you're geniuses for this.

This is one of the smartest PR moves I've ever seen, and I want to pat her on the back for that. I love when Hollywood gets it right. I mean, when's the last time Zan Hathaway missed, right? Zan doesn't miss. Zan's comeback is solidified with her standing in unison. Yeah, between that and the resurgence of the image of her wearing a sheer black top with no bra to a premiere in 20... in 2007 or whatever that's a classic yeah put those two together yeah yeah in fact in fact maybe the photo should have stopped then is she gonna get better than that you know maybe that's why she walked out of the shoot to begin with um well i mean as a member of conde nation how uh how is it affecting you you know they say uh the jokes the joke's funny until It's about you, right? I haven't sent any emails today because I don't want to rock the boat. I stand in solidarity. I heard that the email addresses have been shut out or locked out. No, I think what you're thinking of is the mass layoffs at the LA Times. I've heard both. Oh, really? I don't know if that makes sense for Condé Nast. I don't understand how that would work because no one is... fired or quit it you know what i mean that's not but when you get when you get fired from any of these places it's so ridiculous they treat you like you you're a criminal they like cut off your email address take your laptop and walk you out of the building yeah you know which is always just i find so hilarious for these jobs like this is not a high security threat this is not a problem yeah but you know you have to You have to get in there before they have a chance to delete things, steal files, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, because all those New Yorker columnists stealing their important codes and files. You never know. It could be an Amex number. It could be an email of you talking shit about something that's going to really fuck up that severance package. There's a zillion different reasons why we got to get in there and shut it down. I mean, no, sure.

It's stupid. It's so extreme to me. I love seeing a perp walk from somebody who, you know, from a guy who writes obituaries. Yeah, I want to see a perp walk from a guy who writes about, like, Latin voices for the LA Times. Like, we don't need this guy. Like, this guy is a good guy. He's just doing his job. Let's get him out of here. It's not that big of a deal. You know, but yeah, a lot of layups for the LA Times, and I don't, I mean... I don't know what happens. I don't know where do these people go work. There's nowhere else to go. Are you going to go work at the local paper in Tucson? I don't know what you do at a certain point because 150 people is kind of a lot. Well, I agree. I mean, the destruction of the news middle class, the only people who are making a living are people who are on TV or people who are doing it themselves on a podcast. need the corporate structure and blah blah blah then yeah no no but the sun has set on you no but it's it's also just like yeah i i just don't news i mean the la times is not the new york times or the washington post by any stretch of the of the imagination but it's still like a major city i hate her newspaper i mean it's just true but they but they do what they what they do cover is like hollywood and like the business which is important i mean that's like a big thing that people care about but you can get that stuff a lot of places for free. I'm sure you've been a long-time subscriber to LA Tom. You know my ass has never subscribed to a newspaper. I did it on accident once. Oh, I like that. That's funny. What do you mean? You just clicked on the wrong thing and fell backwards? No, I just want the crossword puzzles. I don't want the whole damn thing. Okay, so before there was an app for just the crossword puzzles, you accidentally subscribed. And you were like, why the hell do these people keep coming to my door every day? And then you realize it'd be your own. Yeah, I don't even like New York. Why am I getting this paper? This place sucks. I don't want to read about New York. I don't even like Los Angeles-based theater.

No, it's been a big day in media news. I'm exhausted already. I'm exhausted already. And speaking of Los Angeles theater, go check out our friend of the show, Kate Berlant. She's doing her show, Kate, at the Pasadena Playhouse, I think for the next number of weeks, maybe a month run or something. Yeah, for a while. I would also like to come see us. Thursday night, San Francisco. There's some tickets available. We have our buddy Phil Griffiths joining us. I think doors are at 730. Howlonggone.com for those. Can't wait to touch down in San Francisco. I got my vest packed. I checked it out. The Equinox is only a six-minute walk from the hotel. Oh, really? Yeah, I'm going to put on my body armor and my helmet and just kind of walk down there. I'm not going to bring a whip. You're going to storm the sauna? I'm going to storm the sauna. I'm not going to bring a weapon that feels extreme. I feel like something bad could happen, but I'm going to protect my head and midsection as best I can. Yeah, tough to kind of get those weapons through TSA as well, even on a JSX flight. How much protection are you allowed to bring on a flight through TSA? If you got a bulletproof vest and a helmet, are they going to be like... Definitely not. I think the bulletproof vest, I don't think they would let it happen. That's a flag. That's a flag, what we call that at the airport. Yeah, that's a flag. I don't think that you can bring maybe some protective eyewear. You can put the district visions on. I don't think you can go much further than that. I feel like anything else is going to be out. Maybe a chain mail. You have to take it off to go through security, but maybe they would let you wear it as an undershirt. Thanks, Biden. How am I supposed to protect my family? We have a guest today. We have a guest today. You guys know him, Jamie Oliver, the British chef. He has a new book, Five Ingredients, Mediterranean. I watched him on the Today Show this morning. He was cooking shit in one pan. which made cooking appealing to me because it's less dishes. But he's – I found out today because, I mean, Jamie Oliver, the naked chef, this guy's a legend. He's been around forever. But I didn't – he's the second highest-selling, best-selling author in all of Britain after the disgraced J.K. Rowling. Second only to J.K. Rowling. Yeah, which is just insane. So cool.

We're going to get into it with Jamie, find out what it's like to have five children, and luckily he can feed all those mouths both physically and financially. That's right. Yeah, I can't wait to talk to him, even though he's not really that much older than us. In his late 40s, I feel like I sort of grew up with him on television. Did you watch it a lot? So it was aspirational. Yeah, I watched it a lot. You know, I was probably 16 and he was probably, you know, early 20s or something like that. But a world apart, you know, if you're a 15-year-old high school kid and you got some hot blonde-haired 22-year-old, 23-year-old chef cooking it up on television, you know, shagging birds and carrying on, it was aspirational. No, no, it's very cool. And I also, I mean, I think it was a different time. But he's done a lot of good too, which I knew about that part a lot about the healthy food stuff. Anyway, let's give Jamie a jingle. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down. The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? You know, especially when it's not, you know, from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace.

Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web. So do our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues. Obviously. Maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world, writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly. A website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded. Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could, you know, have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools so those future graduates can find me. And, you know, I'm able to accept, quote, unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. Show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early. And we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash how long for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code how long to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. I was looking at your hair earlier today, and I got to say, that's a great head of hair. Yeah. I mean, it's like it's one of the few things in my body that's actually, you know. functional and positive in this moment in my life still holding on the hair yeah i mean it's a it just seems you know you're you're not you're a little older than us but i i don't have that that's for sure so i'm just looking at it from a point of jealousy yeah yeah i went to my school reunion the other day and it was it was uh yeah i was one of few that still had a lush head of hair which school what high school college yeah yeah high school you went to your high school okay yeah so it's what 20 20 years 25 years oh god i mean i left when i was 16 so like um like 32 years okay so the 32 year anniversary a classic year yeah like yeah no we i mean we i probably still speak on and off to like 80 of my year like there's

there's a hundred boys in our year and like we've all stayed quite close okay so it wasn't so it wasn't a lot of surprises it was it was more like a nice reunion no no we do like every three years and okay yeah it just is but it's so funny because you just look at all these old these old gits, and you're like, who is that old? And they're like, damn. And then you're like, well, I must look as old as they do. It's just like a root. That is how it works. It's nothing worse than being offended by your own kind of age. Yeah, that happens a lot where you're like, if you are that, then I am this, and that's not good. Yeah, it's humble pie. But you may have had a few more facials than the average geezer that you went to high school with, right? Yeah, I mean, I'm not one for facials. I think I know what you mean by facials. I thought I knew what you meant, but that's changing. You might have more money to throw at the problem of aging than some of your classmates is all I'm saying. Yeah, but this is all natural hair. This hasn't been harvested from other parts of my body. I checked the flight manifest. You haven't been going back and forth to Turkey. I trust you on this. That was my research. Only for the food. They have lovely, fresh herbs there. Amazing fresh herbs. You're in the middle of a book tour. This is Five Ingredients. We'll talk about the book a little bit, but typically, you know, we're just here for a fun conversation. Cool, man. And also, I'm friends with Matt at Taste. He said he's meeting up with you tomorrow. Oh, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, cool. Where are you guys going to dinner in New York? New York. I haven't actually got a list of where we're going. I'm going to go to April Bloomfield's new place tomorrow night. And that's supposed to be really good. Actually, I just saw her this lunch. Okay. Do you have a love? hate relationship with new york or just strictly love or how do you know all love okay all love i mean it's like i think when you're a foreigner coming in and like obviously the community is quite small um there's lots of exciting interesting things going on and there's the new stuff but there's also the kind of the holes in the wall that people love and that you find out about so you know it's all love

and exciting and everything you know everything that's taken for granted here by the locals is new and different and exciting for me so it's just it's creatively it's really good so okay so when you're going to a new restaurant in new york an old place you know you're going to balthazar you're going to some new little spot in brooklyn when you walk in and they're like oh shit oliver's here we gotta we have fire the menu for him i'm saying you've been in many situations over the years where restaurants are just like send him all 17 dishes on the menu how do you navigate that without killing yourself while still showing respect to the the team back there yeah i mean i think it's it's changed over the years i think when i was younger like it was more 50 50 sort of like like love or hate like oh that's great that's great or like he's an asshole um but like i think now as i've got older like quite a lot of the head chefs very lovingly often say oh you know I used to watch the naked chef and actually you got me into cooking or things of that vibe. Essentially what this, essentially what they're saying is you're old. So, um, but no, it's, it's quite nice. I think having that separation of age is actually a really nice thing. And, um, yeah, they're normally lovely. And I think they just, they just are so proud of what they do. They want you to sort of try a little bit of what they're up to. So even if we order just a couple of things, normally a few extra things turn up. So this is why my, this is why my wife hates going out with me. to restaurants because it's like would you like to come and see the kitchen and jules is like i've seen about 13 000 kitchens let me guess a bunch of stainless steel boiling water and shit yeah i got it yeah and so i think like since day dot like it's um you know you're sort of tucking into a little bowl of linguine and like someone comes up and it's like um i i don't want to be that person that's really rude and you're literally about you know to put a spoon in your mouth um so i think uh for jules um it's

often lots of interrupted meals with lots of extras that we didn't really plan the time to enjoy um like you can't be in a rush and often sometimes you are in a bit of a rush like you want to get somewhere and do something you got kids to pick up or whatever um and then kitchen visits so for me i love all of the three you see so i could i just stay there and never go you're like babe go pick them up i'm going to be in the kitchen with these guys for a couple more hours if you're going to a fast casual restaurant where you still like you go to nando's for a quick takeaway and you still have to go take a tour of the kitchen but but you you were saying earlier about you know people will say like hey i'm i run my own restaurant now but i grew up watching you and that makes you feel old but yeah i want to say that i also grew up watching you but i'm also in my 40s so you started out so young that you were growing up yeah as we were growing up watching you as well so with you yeah so you still are very young and you look great don't worry massaging my ego i love you no no problem people people want to ask you about this book or whatever we're here to massage your ego there's a lot of books you know what i mean this is a good deal for you this is a very good deal for you so it seems like you have like a pretty juicy operation with this whole the book the book writing and the book releasing is like a business unto its own at this point right yes um like it was never planned like that i mean i i write a book a year and that seems to be a really healthy a really healthy pattern for me like it themes the whole year it themes everything that i do and it's normally driven by a tv series so it really allows us to resource it and get under the skin of it and if you look back through the i don't know the 26 or 27 books that i've written um you know they're normally like a voyage of discovery something i'm really curious about or like there's a problem and here's a solution so solution based books so historically it's been more 50 50 like i'll do one one year and one another um but in the recent years it seems to be more solution books because we got a hell of problems yeah yeah we got a lot of problems we've got i mean really truly like it's interesting like um when i started as a naked chef like people used to cook for an average of 46 minutes a day and now about

just before covid was 21 minutes um and and i think and the basket data which is the only true data that exists in the food industry really um is sort of saying that it's less than the last one so um yeah i think we we know quite a lot about sort of food from like tiktoks and little you know reels and videos so we kind of visually know quite a lot and we think we know a lot but actually as far as skin on skin like touching and doing probably it's probably never been worse so i mean if you look at five ingredients mediterranean that's if you want to decode it it's kind of really trying to talk the language of people that are busy that expect a lot that love delicious food also want it to be quite healthy and don't want long shopping lists and they and they want it to be quick and easy like it's That's a long list of stuff you want before we've even written a recipe. Do you think – now, do you think it's because we're quote-unquote too busy or do you think it's just like a cultural shift to like dining out and like not caring as much? Yeah, I think it's both. I think the human psyche always shortcuts. The brain is designed to find more efficient ways to do things and then use that time sparingly. And I think along with technology. And along with lifestyle changes, women going to work and just the way that the digital revolution has given us more options to get stuff delivered or, you know, the list goes on and on and on and on. So, I mean, honestly, truly, and I'm not even trying to be dramatic because it is what it is, but the normality of cooking, the joy of cooking is a dying breed. I agree. Especially in this country and especially in my country. um you know they got their kind of they got their claws a bit deeper in europe but that's you know that's for that's because they you know historically had a had a slower industrial revolution but like particularly britain and america yeah and and along with that comes the worst health in the world there's a there's a direct correlation to those two things direct yeah 100 so how how many minutes a day do you think you cook now oh hours like three four hours every day

like today today i won't because i'm sure i don't do look i don't do loads of pr and stuff but like probably three days in america a year um but the normal day yeah for sure professionally and personally so i cook at home i love it yeah one of one of my resolutions this year is to sort of cook every every meal i can cook as much as much as possible but Not just make it, but, like, make all the things. So, like, if I'm going to have a hot dog or a hamburger, make the bun as well. Yeah. I'm not making ketchup, but, you know, you draw the line somewhere. Yeah. Tomato sauce. Yeah. No, for sure. I mean, I like, for me, like, on the weekends as well, like, I think cooking, like, shoes, trainers, high heels, and I know you boys have probably got a fair share of all of those, or gears on a bike. I think cooking can be many things. And I think... in this book we don't do all the gears but like certainly there's cooking that can be fast and furious um there's cooking that you can kind of like get it together in like three minutes bang it in an oven and disappear for 40 minutes and after 40 minutes you've got something that's the house smells amazing and you've got a delicious meal but at the week at the weekend the cooking i really love is like batch cooking put the tunes on have a drink on the go like just enjoy like that cooking where you can just chop some stuff put it in the pan and like there's just a nice linear flow and a big batch of ragu you know like awesome ragu like with wine and spice and herbs and and for me that's joy because i'm going to get dinner that day but also i'm going to get like 20 bags of ragu that i can turn into in an infinite amount of dishes to your point like you don't have to cook every day for that day you can at the weekend you can kind of do those dishes and batch up which is like a kind of gift that keeps on giving really okay so so when you're making these kind of long drawn out lazy sunday multi-ingredient dishes what are you listening to on the saunas what are you drinking what are you smoking don't smoke but i definitely drink i mean i go on the drink um like i go through waves i'm just coming back to wine again having not really been there for like five or six years but i've been on

whiskey tequila got into gin yeah um so just around the world i mean that's yeah if it's wet you like it yeah well one yeah one of my problems is i tend to love everything i'm like i'm just and and you know some people say oh do you really like that i'm like dude have you ever tried good tequila because it's like amazing i hate beetroots have you ever tried good beets like what why do you Like, do you know what I mean? I hate mackerel. It's like, have you had good, I mean, let's. So people are like, is there anything you don't fucking like at all? Yeah, I mean. Just one thing? Not much. I mean, assholes. Like, literally. I've eaten, when I was cooking with a Navajo, I got given like a sphincter. And I chewed on that for a long time. And that, I didn't like that. And I'm happy to start. I mean, even if I put that in a pressure cooker, I think, I'm just going to say I don't like that. But, I mean, kidneys, liver, lungs. um like off like heart like that that can be incredible okay so i just haven't had the right lung yet is what you're saying i just have to get the good yeah okay i don't i don't even think you can buy them in in the states i don't even it's tough to get a lung around here we have some we have some goddamn rules in this country and yeah there's a few things you can't get you know there's a few things you can't get yeah but i think they go into like pet food industry but certainly in in the mediterranean like those Those cuts are what make that, you know, when you kind of have something abroad and you're like, I just can't get it the same back home. And it's normally because they've used all the wrong cuts of meat and there's no offal in there. And it's not necessarily a lot of it. It's just like they almost use the offal like you would when you use anchovy correctly or fish sauce in Thai cooking correctly. Like it's there to balance and harmonize. But yeah, man, I mean, like most things you can make delicious for sure with a few. um squeaky exceptions okay that's a good out that's a good outlook i kind of agree with you in many ways that that if it's the best of something i i might like it you know it's it's going to be a better there's a better opportunity for success well you know like what what what um the world that we know which has only really changed in the last 30 40 years which is driven by supermarkets but if you buy like potato salad in the supermarket

it's going to be like you know but like if you just boil some new potatoes and dress it in some dressing or some even like beautiful greek yogurt and feta cheese and heavy on the mint and the lemon juice like it's amazing like a beautiful mayonnaise like so like even like the most basic things get turned into crap in sort of like when they kind of normalize it so it's like do you like slaw it's like nah it's like there's like a million slaws like it's like because because and you can use them in so many ways and it's like so it's I'm always curious as to what people hate. And in Britain, we sell Crivac packs of pickled giant beetroot. And it's not great. It's not great. All right. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Quince. Jason, the temps are warming up. It's getting hot out there. Summer always changes how I get dressed. I need pieces that feel lighter, more breathable. And they're just easy, but, you know, still put together. I don't want to look like a slob. That's why I keep coming back to Quince. You know, they focus on high-quality essentials that feel and look amazing. Breathable linen and soft organic cottons. Well-made basics, but without the luxury markups. That rare balance where everything feels elevated. but still effortless. Yeah, Chris, linen season is here. I wore a linen blazer to dinner a few nights ago in the warm California sun. But, you know, you got that Italy trip coming up this summer and quality European linen pants and shirts. Upgrade that look starting at just $34. You know, if you get a nice linen suit, a little t-shirt underneath it, some chill shoes, you're looking good, but you're staying cool. The inside of your special areas are nice and dry as you turn up with your besties. So elevate that summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com slash how long for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns, even on a nice holiday now available in Canada. That is Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash how long. That'll get you free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince punto com slash how long. Oh, this is huge for me personally. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by TaskRabbit. Oh, baby, let me tell you something. This is not a joke. I use TaskRabbit a lot because I can't do anything. You need some art hung? TaskRabbit. You need a fucking...

Something put together, a cabinet. Got to reach that cheese grater on the top shelf. TaskRabbit. Anything you need, TaskRabbit can take care of it for you. And, I mean, how it works, TaskRabbit connects you with skilled taskers in your area. They can help you move. They can assemble furniture. repairs, yard work, mounting, and more. You can search for a Tasker based on cost, skill set, availability, and past client reviews so you know exactly who's showing up and can have confidence that they know what they're doing because Taskers have assembled over 3.4 million pieces of furniture, completed 700,000 home repairs, handled 1.5 million moves, and the numbers are just going up, Jason. Yeah, throw a little money at the problem. It's not so expensive, and that job that you really don't want to do is something that another person out in the world, is very good at doing and would gladly do it in exchange for a little bit of money. So... When life happens, your to-do list grows. Get ahead of it now and get $15 off your first task at TaskRabbit.com or grab the TaskRabbit app using promo code HowLong. Taskers book up faster, especially for same-day tasks. So book Trusted Home Help today. That is $15 off your first task using promo code HowLong with the TaskRabbit app or at TaskRabbit.com. the thought of buying a beetroot scrubbing the dirt off of it peeling it boiling it the how you know your pan turns purple it's a lot of steps that people don't want to don't want to do maybe maybe i mean it's like i mean like you could just i mean washing it's like 20 seconds and then you just you know shave it really thin and dress it with with a little a little balsamic salt pepper and a little olive oil and and i and i've even done that in some really rough schools and you kind of go all right who hates beetroot and like everyone hates it it's like cool right give me one minute rattle rattle rattle like have a try and then all right who hates beats and it's like half only half the class that's a good that's a good trick that's a good trick i love i love breaking them down i love breaking them down it's like and it's really interesting it's like because you realize like and it starts from birth you know like and and in the uk and america we've ruined this as well because we're good at ruining stuff in the food business like like

A lot of the baby food is sweetened through pear and apple. So so so like historically, like texture and bitterness, like they would always come in and you'd like to start programming the brain to be aware of these things. And and but we haven't. Right. So like I've worked in really rough schools where we just put a salad bar in and we just shred stuff and dye stuff and some funky little cutters. And then you just put a batch of different dressings at the end. And they whinge and they cry and they kind of cuss you for, like, one week and then two weeks. And even, like, I don't know how you explain it in America, but we kind of, like, we call them, like, rude boys, you know, the ones that sort of, like, swag around with their trousers around. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course. We call those school shooters here, but, yeah. Okay, okay. Well, those rude boys that can, you know, try and play the kind of hard guy. You fast forward six months and, honestly, like, you just put your head around the corner and you see him. He's got a big old tray of, like, just. loads of salad dressing he's kind of got his you know like he's hand leafing the endive now well he's not he's not doing that but he's not doing that but they say that 14 times is how you break someone down and like just normalize something yeah yeah and it's like and the fact that he can build his own yeah like just just normalize i mean if you think about even like some of the some of the best bits of mexican food are the salsas you know and it's like you know oh i don't i don't like that well you like salsa and that's damn good and blacking in it smashing it up spice acid salt a little sweep of that over some grilled meat or fish is delicious so you know all of those little mechanisms you know in the uk like if you try and put veggie in a stew like no i'm not having it but if you do a stir fry with noodles like because down the street they're used to having shredded veggies in there like that's normal for them so it's it's weird like how you've got a essentially what i'm talking about is like how do chefs or mums and dads how do they market

real food to their kids when all they see from the second they're born is like 1800 like nugget burger pizza adverts every single day you know and it's it's it's you know it's like Loving that stuff isn't genetic. It's called marketing. And it works really well. And they own all your best events and music events and all your best sporting events. The only companies that own stuff that's bad for us are food and beverage related, I feel like. Really, you see them a lot. It always strikes me when a professional basketball player or athlete does a Mountain Dew commercial. I'm like, come on, bro. Come on, man. You can't actually drink this. That's $4 million straight away. I get why he's doing it. Ironically, you do that Mountain Dew advert so you can afford to have a nutritionist for your own personal life. Who was that incredible football player that sat down for a press conference and just moved the can of soda away and then pulled out some water? Agua. No, no. I think it was like no Coke or something like that. And that went viral. Then their share prices went down like the next 36 hours. But that's the world we live in, right? No, it really is. I mean, I think that the it's funny to me that it still works in the way that it always has, because we have so much more access and we kind of know more than we ever have before. But but advertising is still the great you could. Everybody falls for it, even though we know better. myself included um what do you think is the healthiest diet of all time like what type of diet for example i think like maybe you're vegan but you eat fish might be the healthiest i love that yeah i mean i with yeah certainly i'm not really i've decided i don't really like labels of like like if you are a vegan like 90 percent of the time but you've got like a bit of a penchant for like sushi like and what it doesn't mean you're at the club

like the club the club's not even a real club anyway it's like like stop and even if you go to india there's like three different types of being vegetarian there's not even one type so um but yeah i think um i mean i i've been lucky i mean i spent two and a half years traveling to parts of the world where they live the longest most productive lives and um it's been a curiosity of mine for quite some time i think that the mediterranean consistently does well you know it it does very very it's it's they have many dishes and vehicles for embracing loads of veggies and just a little meat and fish and and loads of like beans and legumes and and it's delicious certainly the japanese okinawa you know they are eating a lot of seaweed and tofu but i mean in the you know jeju island in in korea like like if you look at the spread but they have meat and they have they kind of got crispy pork there and they got shrimp over here But they've also got like 10 plates of like pickles and like fermented things and like noodles. So there's so I think like those I mean, I think as a general rule, anything that sort of takes, you know, instead of like having like going heavy on the kind of protein and having the veg on the side, I think flipping that tends to be an echo that's quite healthy and gives you longevity. And it's not not saying don't have meat and fish. It's just saying you just wind it down a bit and push that. And of course, historically, that was always driven through cost. You know, like it was expensive having all these prime cuts of meat and the idea of the idea of having a chicken every day is like not normal in most cultures like 40 years ago. Normally, these diets point to what our great, great grandparents were involved in, you know. So, yeah, but I think I still I still think the Greek and Italian cuisines are fantastic at this. Really good. How much of it do you think could be tied to the digestibility of the foods in terms of living longer and healthier? There's a few. I mean, they both end up roughly the same. But I think if you stop looking at food as food and kind of try and squint and look at it as kind of little test tubes of incredible mixtures of minerals and vitamins and nutrients and all of those good things, like your body really wants variation.

even when you speak to people that i think are getting it right like they're often buying the same thing week in week out so if you look at an average american or or british basket there's only about seven like it's four percent in britain right but there's only about seven percent variation week on week right so so yeah we have we're getting all this veg but it's the same veg it's the same chemistry i'm having the same kale caesar five nights a week yeah yeah yeah so your body i think i'm killing it yeah yeah exactly so your body thrives on variation and erratic variation so that's one thing oh really um yeah definitely which is very similar in the gym right chris that is true yeah muscle confusion and muscle confusion yeah very popular yeah i mean it's also just like i'm a habit eater though jamie i gotta be honest with you when i like something i kind of run into the fucking ground you know and then i move on to something else but you're saying i need more variety maybe that's how you're gonna lose that last 10 chris shake it up a little bit yeah but i think But that's why, like, if you're talking about things like chopped salads or slaws or salsa, like, there's no reason that that can't make you just as happy but still surf, like, what's in and what's good and what's available. And they're really good vehicles for that, I think. But, I mean, normally what comes with that is slower digestion and they absorb and break down and get access to more of those nutrients. So that whole thing around. you're not you are what you eat but you are what you absorb so i mean generally i mean for sure like a huge proportion of problems in both of our countries is through lack of fiber so like that's probably at the top of the hierarchy is like americans are deficit in fiber every day about sort of 32 grams a day um and you can fix that pretty quick and what's hilarious about i i think it's the same in the states i'd have to double check but i'm in the uk we say five fruit and fried five fruit and veg a day

like that's what you got to eat and the average is two and a half three and i think you say the same thing five fruit and veg a day in in the states i believe yeah i think so too it's similar i don't even do that and and it's it's slightly worse here but also um like um tomato puree on a pizza counts as one of your five fruit and veg a day so i like that that's that that's the kind of yeah i skirt the law yeah surf that law but the actual the research actually it's it's from seven to eleven that you see the real positive upside So what happens is even the governments, my government, yours, like we lie to the public because we have so little faith in you. Yeah. It's like it's like when your wife takes too long to get ready. So you got to tell her a different start time for the party kind of thing. Exactly. Yeah. And that's the way we like it. Yeah. Well, I think I think when it comes to sort of like early mortality death, it's quite nice to know the truth. I mean, if you had the same theory on like motorway signs, you probably. you'd probably be in a lot of trouble. Um, so it's, um, but yeah, I mean, I think that's, that's the challenge, right? And, and it's nothing new, uh, and our ancestors have all mastered it. And it doesn't mean you can't have the thing that you love or your burger. There's plenty of space to have all these things you love. Normally it's about just real, real stuff as well. Yeah. I've always, I've always heard that, you know, uh, one goal of a good diet is to eat as little kind of packaged food as possible. It's the E numbers, man, especially in the U S it's out of control. The E, what do you mean by E? Ecstasy or are you talking about something else? No, not E, ecstasy. No, EU. European EU. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. It's like, yeah, I mean, you definitely, yeah. There's so many things you can do here that are illegal where I come from. Oh, yes. Like pesticides. Yeah, yeah, we got guns. We got pesticides. No, but like proactive use of antibodies. I mean, when I spoke to like three of the most senior dudes on the planet on like human.

like public health and i'm like so what are the top three things like what are the top three things that are like we should be scared of and like they're like you know what academics are like they're like just like stare at each other and they just give me a minute and they had like four minutes talking between them because they've all got different specialisms and they're like yeah ninja ninja clever and um he said what was it um antibiotic resistance is one of the biggest threats to the planet boring yeah water displacement and an obesity so um they're all kind of wait what was the what was the third one you just said water displacement no no the the did you say ibiza ibiza tea obesity fat oh obesity obesity yeah it's probably my i thought that was a new type of weight loss drink yeah no that's my weird accent okay okay That wasn't making a joke. Ibiza tea is definitely something else. So water displacement, another word for climate change, more or less, right? Yeah. Well, yeah. But also like if you're, if you're like buying loads of gear from Kenya and you're buying beans and fruit and this, and that's really good for their economy. And it's like, you feel good about yourself. It's all fair trade, but essentially you're buying fruit and veg, but actually you're buying water. And then you go and look at the Nile, which is dried up. Like it's it's then you've got this kind of vicious circle where you've got the most vulnerable people getting more vulnerable. So like where and if we know this, then like when does anyone step in and say probably you need to make a living doing something else instead of that? Didn't even think about the water thing. That makes so much sense. Yeah, man. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Because I know so like because because a lot of the developing world really struggles with that area. yeah listen i mean it's it's i think it just comes back to what you were saying earlier they are less processing um more local stuff i mean it i don't know why it's become so like well that's surely that's hard but you know america ultimately was a country founded on small farms oh well out here in los angeles jamie you can go to a farmer's market any day of the week everybody's dressed up in their cool little outfits they got their dogs and their strollers and they're buying all the fresh veg they can fit in their subaru and it's it's it's

But it is, in California specifically, it's like a social outing. It's like an event that you go to on a Wednesday or Saturday or whenever you go. Do you go? I don't cook at all. I only go to restaurants. Jason, do you go to the farmer's market anymore? Sometimes, but not as much as I used to. There's stores that are sort of offering the same level of quality of produce that are open, like Cookbook or other places, small artisanal markets. I usually go to those places now. When I was living in L.A., like, what I used to love is just, like, all the different, like, just the varieties of avocados you could get. Like, I hadn't seen all that. When did you live in L.A.? Sorry for interrupting. Like, I think it was, like, six years ago, seven years. I mean, it might be longer, like, seven, eight years ago. How old was my kids were in elementary school? Yeah, like, geez, that's, like, 12 years ago. What were you doing? Just TV? So I did Food Revolution. um first of all i lived in huntington west virginia which was at that point in time the most unhealthy town in america so um and then and then like that i mean it was probably in i mean i was talking to someone about it was probably we put that show out 12 years before maybe it should have been put out really um but it did really well we got an emmy for that and it's like okay where we put him next and then they put us in um the la usd in the school district so so i was there there for that and i really it was it was very hard work um yeah we were living sort of up near brentwood and it couldn't have been nicer literally and then and i was work i was working in east la every day and uh actually i loved it i mean it was it was some parts were tricky and and rough um and and you know the you know the score down there but i loved it it was yeah it was really powerful work and and working with the hispanic community and it was like it was amazing it really was and we were working in um uh where we weren't allowed in the schools we got banned by the head of the uh la school district you were causing too much trouble yeah yeah so then we went to um like an independent school and they're like yeah we want you this is amazing and um like we're not run by like the the same people and of course they are but they just didn't know it

So, you know, so I was I was working in the school and you just know they've got these little invisible bits of rope. There's like, yeah, you will do what you're told. So I think I got banned from every school in L.A. Every Tuesday you could go to the public hall and say, ask anything about the school food system. And there's a reason for this. Obviously, they've had problems and corruption in the past. But by law, it was my right to go. but i just go with a massive hollywood crew of like 30 people steady cameras jibs the whole thing you know and we turn up and uh it was a guy called guy called raymond cortinez um and he uh and so you can ask your question but they don't have to respond so i did this i think for like that's an interesting that's an interesting arrangement you can ask anything you want but we don't have to respond yeah yeah but i did it i did it i did it like clockwork for like six seven six seven weeks And my questions got more and more provocative. And then eventually I broke him and he just like laid into me and kicked my ass. And as he was doing it, I'm like, thank you so much. Yeah, this is exactly what we came for. Gonna see your true colors. And of course, it made it to the show. But then we got a new person in charge, funny enough, and made some good change. no regrets that was that was exciting work all right that's a you really saw both sides of la i'll say that brentwood to east la is yes not a great commute but also it's it's very different very i work with the old um guy in charge what's the biggest job in la mayor not the mayor i think it's another title of what did schwarzenegger do governor yeah i i worked with one of the old governors to sort of reauthorize a water bill and it was like it's tricky i mean we haven't You know, at least in the UK, like all the water's clean. You know, and I know it's easy for us to say because we're a little island. You know, we're a little island. But, you know, no, but I think it does. Water's an interesting one, isn't it? It's like that's that's base. Yes. The most base. Yeah. So then you have like the poorest community with free school lunch kids going into school. They have to take the most expensive way of getting water through all these.

evian bottles or whatever's going in um so that can't be great and the sugar juice is cheaper than the bottled water yeah and you and certainly at the time you could only get a free school lunch if you were a free school lunch kid if you took a flavored milk oh hell no you had to have strawberry milk to get a free lunch yeah well then that had more total sugars than a can of coke so that was that was like this is not this cycles we need to bring out a solution this is not the solution guys that is not the solution but more more to the point like it's just a brilliant opportunity for thoughtfulness and love and care and and like you know getting some decent food into them but yeah it's brilliant being it's such a gift being a foreigner look to look from the outside in is i think such a healthy position like when i go say around italy like it's much easier being not italian because there's the italians are always arguing with each other so when you just come in from the side like like you're neutral and then certainly like when we looked at the school food system over here it's like well but i know the one back home and i know europe really well and they're like you can't do that you can't use a knife and fork like knives are dangerous it's like come on like like it's you can't use a knife and fork and you're like okay america is different america is different it's like well like what you haven't you would give a seven-year-old child a knife to i'm like yeah of course like every school and every country in europe and it's like that's terrible it's like no it's not terrible it's like it's terrible that your seven-year-old cannot use a knife without stabbing each other yeah that's the problem because well when we changed the food of course you did have to you needed a knife or fork to eat it because it wasn't just yeah when it's not when it's not a hamburger or chicken fingers you're going to need a knife and fork to kind of make this thing work so that that didn't that had its complexities but um but you know but yeah it was it was a pleasure to do and like i said i think it was 12 years too early it would be good to happen now really i think the world's a bit

you know it's worse off but yeah yeah well sometimes in my game as well like you can be two years too late or a few years too early and it's like if you don't like anything even if it's genius like if you get it too late or too early like it just it's not going to work so it's the timing thing is just so we might not even be ready for five ingredients mediterranean is that what you're saying yeah Am I too early or too late? Should have pushed this to 27 maybe. Yeah, 27 feels right for this. I don't know. We've got, in a few weeks, we've got Valentine's Day coming up. This is a question I like to ask a lot of chefs. Are you going to cook at home? Or are you going to go out to a restaurant maybe on a different day, a couple days after? No, I like to cook at home. But does your wife like it, having Valentine's Day at home every year? Yeah, for sure. Okay, good. His house is probably a little nicer than yours, Jason. I'm just guessing. I guess if you're cooking in your house, it's better than other people's houses and cooking. Normally in restaurants, it's very busy and things are priced up and everyone's upselling. And it's supposed to be about romance and sort of, you know. you know, looking into their eyes and, you know, planning a happy ending to the meal. But I think it's a bit like New Year's Eve. It's like going to a restaurant on New Year's Eve. Like, you're just going to get leathered, really. And I say that as a restaurateur. So I think home's nice. You save a load of money. Make it nice. Turn the lights down. Light a candle. Put some Sade on. There we go. where do you live like do you live do you live in london or you live outside the city i lived in london for 25 years and now i live about an hour and a quarter out of london in the countryside about 20 about 20 minutes from where i grew up as a kid beautiful yeah it's nice i i used to you know i used to sort of live in the city and i just after covid i thought right i've had enough you've had enough i mean do you have i mean you have to go back pretty often i'm sure you get your fill yeah no i commute now so i drive into london three times a week maybe four but um

And I try and do three long days and put the hours in and then have like two slightly easier days, Monday and Friday, if all things go according to plan. But yeah, I mean, I love London. London's wicked. But it's like, I don't know, it's nice to be out of the chaos. You did it. You earned your strength. Especially if you like driving your car more than 10 kilometers per hour. Yeah. Yeah, no, I quite like driving. Okay. Are you a car guy? I'd like to be. But when you've got five kids. Yeah, you've got a lot of kids, man. We were going to talk about that. You've got a lot of kids. You have adult kids at this point. Yeah, I've got from seven to 21. That's crazy because you're really only a few years old than us, and we barely have anything really to show for it. So I just – being responsible for – I mean, I know you're married. You have help, et cetera. But, like, man. Five kids is not a game. Yeah, no. Is that the plan? No. I thought that we were doing it too, but my wife had different thoughts, and I have no restraint. So that's the answer to that story. It was very well put there, Jamie. Very well put. No, no. Very well put. When I got three down, I'm like, I know her plan. I know how she manipulates me. And you let it happen. Yeah. and i prepared myself for it i meditated like do not accept do not accept and and uh i'm you know it's always it's always a drought a drought followed by utter enthusiasm and i fall for it every time so you know you could there's worse ways to be manipulated i suppose yeah yeah way worse way worse but what it what it means is you go from like like where i come from in the country is famous for boy racers So boys that would take a perfectly decent car, lower it, put big, you know, wheels on it and the sound system. And we call them Barry's, right? So that's genetically I should be of that ilk. So I had a little moment where I had like a couple of tasty cars. And then as soon as I knocked out a certain amount of kids, it went to a Renault traffic. I mean, by all means, Google what a Renault traffic is. And that's my family car.

And you get a lot of car for your money. Let's just put it that way. And down the motorway, it sounds like a wobble board. So you don't have any tasty cars in the garage at all? No, now I've had to leave. I now have, I would say, a medium interesting car, which is a Maserati. Okay, that's good. And it's quite nice to look at, and it's quite good fun to drive. Gives you that good sound when you step on the guy. Yes, it's not too bad. But, yeah, I think, so I'm coming back, guys. I'm coming back, and I'm working on this. So when you're commuting like this. This is, what are you listening to in the CD changer of the Maserati podcast? Are you listening to How Long Gone? Are you listening to Blur? Are you listening to Oasis? What are we talking about? Stone Roses. Yeah, I mean, you've hit quite a lot. And I think probably, like, I have a, if you go on Spotify and put Jamie Oliver, if you see me in a yellow jumper, that is my general go-to mixtape, which is a compilation of, like, indie, miserable, uplifting. not that you can't have miserable and uplifting i find miserable stuff quite uplifting is what i meant to say um same same and um yeah that's that's my kind of go-to but you mentioned quite a few um 80s and 90s and then just some new young hipsters that are doing kind of cool and interesting things I know I'm really late to party, but I just started doing podcasts and audio books. You probably have four podcasts on the BBC that you don't even know exist. You forgot you did that. I've never had my own one, but I obviously do stuff like this. I like the idea of you being like, shit, I guess they turned that TV show into a podcast. That's great. You guys enjoy. You guys love that. Easy for me. I'm super late to the party, but everyone loves them. But when you're in the car for two hours, it's quite good to sit back and go on a bit of a journey. Now, when you were younger, were you going to a lot of gigs? Were you out every night? Quite a lot, yeah. And in London, and even where I grew up in the local towns, there was quite a good rock and roll scene. And you'd have people that were up and coming. And I used to be in a band.

um uh back in the day from 11 to 23 i was in a band but um what is your discipline what instrument is your discipline probably the most predictable one i was a drummer oh okay yeah do you keep a set in the house these days or no yeah yeah i've started you know i've tried to keep keep my end in as it were and um okay so so you're you're when you're 11 to 23 let's say somebody you're 11 years old they're like hey do you want to join the band it's a combination of this and this what was what was this band um our sound was probably did you ever hear of a band called garbage yeah of course of course yeah so that was probably like that's what people used to say we sounded like but we were like synthy guitar-y um my my style of drumming was kind of more sort of breakbeat kind of okay i guess indie hip-hoppy sort of drumming shuffling about so you're a little bit of a quest love as a youngster is what you're saying yeah i'd like to think so you know i wasn't i wasn't a steve gad okay i like that i like that you're still keeping up it's important to do that yeah i mean i kind of um yeah i i really it's a part of me that i miss a lot it was a massive part of my childhood and obviously um i had to focus on the cooking um and it wasn't meant to be but it's i think it's always in you and The only thing I get to do now is I get to, because we make our own productions for TV, I can jump in the studio once every six weeks and we'll just do a soundtrack to the show. And over there in Europe, you're able to use music from bands and artists that we all like versus in America where it's just like awful kind of generic background music. Yes and no. More so in Italy or something like that than London. for me is that we distribute to 120 countries around the world so we would have to get publishing rights for five of the districts of the world that's going to be tough and it's like 100 yeah you just getting a decent track will cost the same as a whole show you can't get tom york on the phone for five you know it's tough i have done it historically and there's and there's like you know but it's like 180 grand which is like what's the i don't know what the dollar to the pound is but um it's it's not dissimilar right now it's it's like

yeah it's so it's it doesn't work economically but i've done you know i've used soul to soul tracks before and and and a couple of i added i had a geezer um there was a song called buffalo stance by nina cherry of course no no no one had really heard in the uk for a while so i kind of put it in a in a show that we did actually now that sounds kind of familiar it did it cost a fortune and our production manager like you can't do it and i'm like listen like 24 shows like it's going to go to 120 countries like do the maths it works out like you know yeah it's a cost per listen kind of vibe is good yeah it's it's like that's because what happens is you make a beautiful bit of work and then as soon as it gets out of the uk they carve it up with this library music that sounds like you're in like some kind of like fast food where it's like weird So we did do that. And then I was down, I was down the farmer's market and this geezer came up to me and said, I just want to say thank you so much. I said, what for? He goes, I just got like 50 grand off you. And I'm like, how? He's like, um, Buffalo stance. Like I was one of the writers. I'm like, cool. So like, so are you a producer? You were right. He goes, no, no, no. Like back in the eighties, like I was a, I think he said he's graphic designer or something like that, but everyone was just having a go. Everyone was just like having a go and getting amongst it. And he goes, and out of nowhere, I'll get your check. And I'm now taking my kids on a lovely holiday. We're doing this. We're doing that. So it's kind of cute. It's cool because you grow up. You listen to a song that you love, an artist that you admire. You get older. You become in a position of power where you can get a cool little $200,000 check into their mail. And I love the idea that there was like really like random bonkers collaborations going on. And I still to this day think that collaborations between. various whoever is it that's how you get some really different stuff happening and um and i guess you see it in trainers don't you see it in films trainers like artists it's a pizza hut the taco bell all in one building right we see it all we see it everywhere yeah well you never say never well well speaking of the international outreach that you have you said 120 different countries

You're obviously the most well-known in the UK and Europe, and you're big in America as well, but what's one kind of unexpected country where you're actually quite popular there? For me, yeah. Like, for example, for us, we're quite big in Copenhagen and Denmark. Yeah, really? For whatever reason. Oh, that's cool. Yeah, yeah. In Australia. Yeah, Australia. There's no real rhyme or reason to it. Yeah, well, first of all... But you just see the data. Yeah, well, out there, like, have you ever been there, Copenhagen? Yeah, yeah. That's an amazing part of the world. And they, like, honestly, like, if you go around the Nordics, they often speak better English than we do. Like, I'm like, damn, are you English? And they're like, no, no, no. I'm like, wow, your English is better than, like. you're like we're not english we're just smarter than you yeah they really are they really are we try harder actually i'm just uh better at life than you are yeah um and they're quite and their humor is quite blunt and they would love you guys like totally like they know they're dry as a bone over there we did a show over there in august and behind the dryness is some like they're they're blunt and funny oh yeah um and there's and there's some amazing food out there as well um but yeah like i mean probably the most random place i don't know um probably like i had a friend sort of say oh my god you're all over lithuania at the moment i'm like really what do you mean they're like billboards everywhere this i said i've never been and they're like you're all over the adverts the bus stops i'm like okay cool like i didn't know um send me a picture so um yeah that's the power of distribution is like is continually i mean like even when when i first came to the states like the first time i ever arrived i i i arrived in i think lax or something like that and the naked chef had just launched and food network like they were launching as well um and they just kind of taken the naked chef and they had some agency do that and as you went down from the airport into la it was just like provoke provocative melons and peaches that looked like bums and boobs and like and then like jamie oliver the naked chef has arrived and it's like damn like

fruit never looks so good but um i never and i remember in between these different fruits was like fat boy slim he was like breaking at the same time that's not quite as cool as fat boy slim but i'll take i'll take the melons it's a british picker i mean i just i can't imagine a time where in la you would have a series of billboards for a small cable network cooking show for sure they were launching so i think that was their life food network itself was launching yeah it's like the very beginning and it was literally it was like it was me emerald lagasse and bobby flay and all the other talent that exist now weren't even anywhere you know so the trifecta yeah it was um quite some years ago but yeah no yeah i think like they always have a bit more budget at the beginning for like kicking it off of course yeah that's that's kind of a lesson i've learned in life many times there's always a little more money at the beginning so so you've got a you've got a do you have a book event in new york tomorrow plugging this yeah i have let's give it a plug real quick before we finish up yeah thank you um where's the book event tomorrow um kimbo rich only on broadway Oh, it's a beautiful store. So, yeah, we're doing that tomorrow. Looking forward to it. You're not cooking, though, are you? Just talking? I think I'm just talking. But if they bring a pot and a pan and some food, I'll definitely cook. I'm happy. You guys bring me stuff to make a sandwich. I'll make a sandwich. OK, that's fine. You don't know what to do with your hands otherwise. Right now. Well, I am quite fidgety, so I'm always better with like I prefer talking and cooking at the same time anyway. um but i think it's a small is it uh i'm pretty is it a small bookstore what is what what is it no it's it's i mean it's risoli is like an a pretty you know it's an art book publisher this is their store it's fairly new it's it's not small it's it's pretty big but it's but it's it's well done it's cool it's in like oh we can yeah it's in um i've been it's in like the 20s well give it give us a plug and then hopefully someone like somebody some people turn up there's nothing

I'll never forget in the early days, man, like you do an event and no one would turn up and you're like, this is really uncomfortable. That hurts. Loser. It's probably been a while since that's happened. Yeah. You never know. Yeah. Now, listen, it's always you've got to keep, you know, keep on your toes. Hopefully. Hopefully, if I do a couple of little social posts as well, that might get some of the locals turning up. Of course. Let's see. No, no, no. The weather is so beautiful, people are going to be excited to come outside. You know what I mean? Put on six layers, walk down to see you talk about the beautiful Mediterranean flavors. Yeah, there you go. A little bit of fresh lemon juice on top. Sounds like a dream Wednesday. And they're like... But you know, it's always... Definitely if they do a Q&A, Q&As are always great. Because you just don't know what questions are going to come your way. And then you see some... cute kid ask a question and like they ask you the hardest question ever you know it's like so you just you just don't i i love that i love that and you can how do you solve global warming i'm only this menu Oh, yeah. I've had a few of those. All right, so tomorrow night in New York. Which is technically tonight because this episode comes out tomorrow. Yeah, this will be out tomorrow. So, yeah, tonight, go to Rizzoli. Do I say that or do you say that? We both have said it. We both have said it. Whoever did the better job will make the final cut, Jamie. Yeah, yeah. We'll see. We'll see whose turn it is, big dog. No, but, Jamie, thank you for joining us on How Long Gone. It was a pleasure. And we'll see you soon. Definitely, guys. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me